• Tawan
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Thailand News & Views
To Bring the World to Thailand and Thailand to the World in English.
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Sunday , August 19 , 2007
Thai Democracy Yes Western Democracy No
Posted by Tawan , Reader : 1233 , 00:39:01  

I agree with a recent statement I hope Thailand will find the right way into a bright future. IMO Thai Democracy does not need to be a copy of Western Democracy. The blogs that say Thais do not understand democracy need to look at their own democracies.

I believe Thais are free. I believe Thais are tolerant people. I believe Thais are intelligent people.

I agree with China, western society has more than enough problems of their own and has no right to criticize other countries. It is not constructive criticism being offered by western societies. It is criticism offered with a holier than you sarcastic superior attitude that all things western are superior education, government, business, people etc.

May I ask? Are westerners born with this trait of absolute belief that they are superior or is that trait taught in your education system? What Thai people do not need is a history lesson about the Civil Liberties ratified in 1791 by the US Congress known as the Bill of Rights by hypocrite slave owners. You want to know about Civil Rights ask Martin Luther King after 250 years of living in a so called free democratic society the struggle continues today against the same leaders that seems to forget the recent past that they were a part of in western society. Even though Dr. King is gone the powers that he fought against are still alive today. If the US democracy model works like the above statements with 300 years of experience of not getting it right how is it going to work in Thailand?

Thailand does not need to be an exact copy of the US. China proves that communism and free markets work. Japan proves that Japan Inc works none of which copies the US. The US policy of you are either with us or against us proves how narrow minded the US is and is the major cause of a lot of problems in the world. What problems is Thailand causing in the world on that scale?

I would rather walk the streets of Tokyo at midnight than try that in New York the so called capital of the free world. As far as history lessons the western free world needs to go back and read those great documents and start living by them.

Yes, we need constructive criticism not laced with sarcasm and the word respect needs to be added back to the English dictionary and used.

I have noticed too many westerners speak without concern for the listeners thoughts are feelings. This is not the Thai definition of freedom and is a sign of a very uneducated person.

Thai Democracy Yes, Western Democracy No

Read comment

comment 14
Ian date : 22/08/2007 time : 21.08

Democracy is an expression of the will of the people, so it can exist in many forms, so you can even end up with a people as an expression of their democratic rights, rejecting democracy . A voluntary dictatorship. This was what happened in Nazi Germany.
Democracy is not a "constitution", it is a way of thinking, it is something you grow up with not just create out of air.
comment 13
krisnawani date : 22/08/2007 time : 15.18

It is not about understand. We do not even make an effort to learn them. In grade school, have you ever been educated in the Constitution of Thailand. I was never. I had to read the Constitution of Thailand on my own and it is not as easy to understand. If, you have question, it is very had to find documents to justify the making of the laws or amendments.
How much do Thais really understand their constitution and the basic rights?
The first issue that the Ministry of Education is to create a subject that deals with Politics and Constitution. You teach the students all type of political systems and the Constitution of Thailand and constitution of other country that have failed like the French pre-World War and the English post-elimination of monarchy power over the parliament. We have to learn not be told what is good and bad so that we can make a decision on ourselves of what is good & bad for the country.
I think you are a hater of West because, you seem to have personal agendas
I am a pro-socialist and not a believer in democracy.
comment 12
Tawan date : 22/08/2007 time : 00.02

You are totally wrong. Every point you made can find historical events in western society that shows western democracy killing people also and western injuustice in western society.

The west has the same problems and is still working on solutions for a better society just as we are in Thailand.

Democracy is not static it is ever changing and it is not owned by the west every country works out its own democracy.

The idea that just because we are Thai we can not understand democracy is absurd.
comment 11
krisnawani date : 21/08/2007 time : 20.18

I am sorry but Thai Democracy does not work. You are right that Thai people are not stupid; they are actually quite knowledgeable even in up countries. We are also extremely gullible. But, we simply do not care about democracy. We do not know our basic right as a Thai. We think we know, but do we really know. The street vendor sell food without investment of a store, while honest store owner cannot compete because, we have accepted that they have a right to sell. Sometimes you park the car on the street, some gangster will ask parking fee from a public street. If we do not pay, they will damage our car and the cops are in on it.
The Chinese are destroying the environment and human life just to gain a dollar. They run tanks over people who did not agree with them in public. They help fund dictators Africa just to ensure that their oil stream is safe.
The Bills of Rights is a great document of human basic rights. In America, slavery was a common thing so, was in Thailand. Thailand did not end slavery until King Rama V. Later the country went to war to fight for equality of slaves. Dr. King is a great man who was able to fight for more equality because, past American (black and white) provided him with that right. Never misunderstand his intension that he ever want a white man to respect him, he wanted government institution to be equal. It is the basic understand of right and wrong that we in Thailand totally lack. We have no discipline what so ever. You see people crossing the street when, the skywalk is right on top of their head.
Japan is a warring nation that destroyed China, Thailand and other country for their personal gain. The Japanese constitution was drafted by the American after the 2nd World War and participated in the American capitalist concept. China was a non-factor in world politics until the adopted the American capitalist system.
You first need to understand the basic of free speech to appreciate it. Free Speech is the ability to say thing even though it is so disgusting to the general public. Why, because free speech is the key basis to a strong democracy. It allows your voice to matter. It is better than writing symbol or abbreviation of people you are say bad thing about in Thailand. I love democracy, but we do not have a system that even resembles a democracy in Thailand. I will keep dreaming that one day we will get one.
comment 10
Tawan date : 21/08/2007 time : 11.18

I think I am getting losted here not sure of the meaning. But if you want me to rant more you will have to wait until next month I am really good at it then.
comment 9
GGrass date : 21/08/2007 time : 08.47

Tawan: <-- you're such an angel...

i think more of us should think like you. have some pride and guts.

Dam: yeah man. Go asia man.
comment 8
Dam date : 20/08/2007 time : 23.09

Yes, Tawan, I strongly support your view of " Thai Democracy Yes Western Democracy No". Even buying of vitamin pills the shop keepers will tell you this is passed through the American standard. What a sh*t. We are Asians.
comment 7
Tawan date : 20/08/2007 time : 21.55

Great comments Khun GGrass you are right this was an emotional blog. No I am not going to defend an emotional blog it would be pointless.

It has served its purpose of allowing me to rant and I feel much better. This is an emotional time for Thailand with so many experts writing on Thai politics I had nothing constructive to add not my field.

More than anything looking forward to the elections and moving forward for Thai democracy.
comment 6
GGrass date : 20/08/2007 time : 12.12

Tawan: this is my thoughts after reading you blog. it's a nice blog, interesting and emotional. i wish there were more of this sort of blog, which has personaly thoughts rather than fashionable ideas. i'm bored of referendum and all that political stuff that's going on these days, so it's a fresh breath of air to read someone's personal feeling about western and thai democracy.

but i really hope you have the stomach to back up your blog coz what i'm about to comment might not be too friendly. here i go....

after reading your blog, i must say, you must be a die hard fan of Great Leader Mao Ze Dong. (Not that there's anything wrong with being a fan of Mao.) Why not simply say, Thailand should follow China? might as well do that since most of the power and money is held by the chinese in thailand anyway.

and as for walking down the street at midnight, what's THAT got to do with democracy???

i'm not a great fan of yankees myself, but hey, did you ever see on the headline,

'COUP in US of A!' anywhere, anytime, by any press?

NO, coz it never happens. At least they don't try to solve problems with medieval weapons like Tanks and Rifles. (they use more high tech weapons like FREEDOM OF SPEECH)

and you say, 'Are westerners born with this trait of absolute belief that they are superior or is that trait taught in your education system?' --> what's this about? it's such an outdated argument. Just because you feel inferior, it doesn't mean they feel superior.

and finally, you say

'Thai Democracy Yes, Western Democracy No'


comment 5
Ian date : 19/08/2007 time : 18.40

Tawan, ok but please remember that the term westerner is in many ways as unspecific as calling you an Asian. America no more represents western culture than China represents Asian culture:-)
comment 4
Tawan date : 19/08/2007 time : 11.51

Sorry Khun Ian. I know what it feels like being lumped into a group you do not belong to. Having lived in the US I have been lumped in to many groups but Thai.

I do not comment on Britain simply because I have never been there and thus no nothing about it.

My comments are directed to Americans because I do have experience living in the US.
comment 3
Ian date : 19/08/2007 time : 05.16

I am thoroughly fed up as a westerner with automatically being lumped in with America. I am not American, I am a citizen of a country which is the oldest existing democracy in the world.
I have many, many, times in these blogs stated that western democracy is not for Asia, it cannot work in an Asian culture. Countries such as Thailand have to create their own form, it will be a restricted, paternalistic form of democracy, democracy by dictate and degree. In the West we call this an oligarchy.
comment 2
LIEBE date : 19/08/2007 time : 02.11

Thailand should stop being stuck up with those rational. In Dr. King's period he protest agaisnt the government and the head of the state. Can you stand up and protest agaisnt the head of the state? .. I don't think so even think about it. soooo.. Thais are NOT free anymore.

I do agree with some western thoughts. and also I really believe those thoughts would worked in Thailand. anyhow, first western started to have democracy was Greek and whole western copied and adopt the same thing. what's the problem if Thailand would do it too?

ps. who said Thailand should copy USA?
comment 1
LLCoolM date : 19/08/2007 time : 01.24

First of all I dont' think that Thais are free. If they would be free then why so much ppl fear to talk open? They are scared about Military, scared about lese majeste they been teached to shut up and let others think. I dont believe there is a western and there is a thai democracy. There is just democracy which means living free without fear of anything or anyone.

BTW. I beleive there more countries around the world. Not only the USA and they do have old history and they do have democracies. Every democracy has it bad sides but Thailand don't have a democracy and they never had one.

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